1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Welcome to Lake Valor!
    Catch, train, and evolve Pokémon while you explore our community. Make friends, and grow your collection.

    Login or Sign Up

#BringBackNationalDex

Discussion in 'Switch Pokémon Games' started by Sethal, Jul 9, 2019.

  1. Sethal

    Sethal Vibing to OST

    Aurile
    (Alolan Vulpix)
    Level 1
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2017
    Posts:
    1,252
    PokéPoints:
    ₽1,428.1
    Comet Shard ★★★★Star Piece ★★★★Cooler Gary Oak ★★★★★Water Stone ★★★Thunder Stone ★★★
    This hashtag is currently pretty common in social networks. After Game Freak announced that not all Pokémon will be available in the upcoming Pokémon Sword and Shield games, the fanbase got torn. One side is against this decision, while the other is for it. Both sides have pretty good arguments, and I would like to know how you feel about this. Will you still buy the games?
    Or do you feel like that there's no issue with that?
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  2. Grimwave

    Grimwave Decepticon

    Megatron
    (Beldum)
    Level 7
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2018
    Posts:
    3,391
    PokéPoints:
    ₽153.2
    Dome Fossil ★★★Premier Ball ★Darkinum Z ★★★★Reaper Cloth ★★★Luxury Ball ★★★
    I still plan on buying myself a copy of Pokémon Sword. Despite not having some of my favorite Pokémon, that's not enough to ruin the experience for me. I have faith that they're going to be great games, and tbh I'm more interested in seeing what new Pokémon there are rather than just focusing on the previous generations. They've already come out with some interesting designs and there's a lot of potential imo.
    I'm not really "for" or "against" the decision, I would have liked to have all the Pokémon in the game, but people need to understand that there really is a lot of effort being put into improving the models, animations, etc. and that the game would have had nearly 1000 Pokémon if all were included which would have taken up a lot of data and resources.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    RadEmpoleon, Neb and Sethal like this.
  3. KnightBlader

    Mina Ashido
    (Mudkip)
    Level 13
    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2019
    Posts:
    127
    PokéPoints:
    ₽399.0
    I honestly don't really care too much as long as the game is a good one.
    As for the arguments on both sides, I feel like quite a few of them are actually just bogus critique by people that have no clue how things work, and we also have precedent where forcefully adding content didn't really make a game better (Unpopular thoughtpiece: I love Johto as a region concept and how it is designed, but the forceful inclusion of Kanto kinda ruined the level cap and how fleshed out Johto could have been for what feels like a barren wasteland.)

    I mean, if I can't import my shiny Quagsire I caught in Gen 4 then that obviously whomps, but there will be a different game where I can use it again so... I don't really mind.
    As a draft league player though, quite disappointing, indeed.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Sethal likes this.
  4. Neb

    Neb Cosmog Enthusiast

    AZ
    (Flabébé (O))
    Level 12
    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2018
    Posts:
    927
    PokéPoints:
    ₽2,229.2
    GS Ball ★★★★★Love Ball ★★★★★Poké Ball ★Potion ★Oran Berry ★★
    I can see why a lot of fans are disappointed, but the reaction from both sides is a bit out of hand (although that’s true for any internet controversy).

    Personally, I’m fine with it because it doesn’t affect the main game and because Pokémon needed another soft-reboot anyway.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    RadEmpoleon and Sethal like this.
  5. Hraesvelgr

    Hraesvelgr Snek in Your Boot

    Zapdos Egg
    (Zapdos Egg)
    Level 21
    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2014
    Posts:
    8,214
    PokéPoints:
    ₽11,794.7
    Trainer Card - Cave ThemeDragon Fang ★★★★Philosopher's CowlWater Stone ★★★Great Ball ★★
    I've come to terms with it and are now fine with it now, it was bound to happen that we wouldn't be able to keep all mons in the games. I just didn't think it would be this generation so it surprised me greatly. I'll buy the games, both versions like I always do and if the limited transfer is the only issue I have I suspect I'll still enjoy them greatly.

    I believe Quagsire is actually one of the mons confirmed to be in the Galar dex so you should be able to eventually get your shiny one over.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    #5 Jul 9, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2019
    Sethal likes this.
  6. Grimwave

    Grimwave Decepticon

    Megatron
    (Beldum)
    Level 7
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2018
    Posts:
    3,391
    PokéPoints:
    ₽153.2
    Dome Fossil ★★★Premier Ball ★Darkinum Z ★★★★Reaper Cloth ★★★Luxury Ball ★★★
    The reactions from the opposed side do have me a bit... annoyed, and concerned.
    Every time I go through the comments of one of Pokémon's posts (usually on Instagram), there's usually a crowd of people that will scatter #BringBackNationalDex throughout the comments, or make complaints and arguments that are not always reasonable.
    I think people have taken it a bit too far in some respects.
     
  7. Sethal

    Sethal Vibing to OST

    Aurile
    (Alolan Vulpix)
    Level 1
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2017
    Posts:
    1,252
    PokéPoints:
    ₽1,428.1
    Comet Shard ★★★★Star Piece ★★★★Cooler Gary Oak ★★★★★Water Stone ★★★Thunder Stone ★★★
    I can agree with that. I mean, every single post from the Pokémon Officials is being littered with this hashtag. I generally don't have problems with this, but the number of them is just unnecessary high.
     
  8. DuoM2

    Groudon Egg
    (Groudon Egg)
    Level 18
    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2019
    Posts:
    559
    PokéPoints:
    ₽1,398.7
    A lot of my opinions are reiterating others' on the thread but I felt like saying mine anyways.

    I was at first shocked and upset about this, though not to the extent of any of the people flaming others on Twitter over it. That went away in a day though. If you're STILL going out of your way to argue or complain at other people, whether it be Nintendo/Game Freak/Masuda himself or the people who are "protesting," then that's wrong. The people who are going after those people have already had their opinions clearly heard and them continuing this is doing nothing; the only thing they can do left of any substance is just not buying the game, which is perfectly fine. The people who are attacking those people are just making them angrier, which is completely pointless and kind of a jerk move in all honesty.

    As I said before I'm not upset about this now despite two of my three favorite Pokémon possibly being cut. Tentacruel and Sableye both bear a lot of similarities design-wise with Jellicent and Impidimp, with Jellicent actually being made as a Gen 5 mirror to Tentacruel. I spent a LONG time trying to get a Shiny Sableye, and after a lot of patience and breaks, I actually succeeded, and that's the only Pokémon I hold any emotional value to. Possibly losing the two of them kinda sucks, but I'll get to use Tentacruel and Sableye in another game in the future, since they said they'd be rotating the Pokémon around.

    I think the people posting the hashtag's biggest argument is that they're just expecting quality from the games...and that's entirely subjective. I disagree with the statement that these games are going to be low-quality, though; despite Game Freak having a low amount of staff members, and despite one tree texture looking awful, they went out of their way to add stuff like open-world aspects that their fans have been wanting for years, on top of adding sort of "bonus" stuff we never even asked for like the version exclusive gym leaders, and despite this being only their second Switch game, it still looks very good aside from that one tree texture.

    I'm gonna close in saying that it's perfectly fine to be upset about this. This is a big change to the games that hasn't really happened since Ruby and Sapphire, and you may be emotionally attached to some Infernape or something and may not want to be forced away from using it for a year or two. However, it's not fine to go attack people on social media, or to go out of your way to attack those people. That's extremely childish and nobody is gaining anything from it; nobody is "hearing your message" since they've all already heard it.

    All of this is just my two cents. I'm not too invested in learning about both sides of the argument because most people making the arguments are extremely aggressive towards the other side. Really hope I didn't come across as rude in any way over this, please let me know if I did.

    (tl;dr - Neither "side" is right, you can have whatever opinion you want as long as you're not aggressive about it. I don't care about this change.)
     
    Kecleon, SyWry, Sethal and 2 others like this.
  9. Darcy

    Darcy Strongest Blade in Valor

    Eurydice
    (Brione)
    Level 21
    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2016
    Posts:
    679
    PokéPoints:
    ₽1,068.1
    Philosopher's CowlPsychium Z ★★★★Gardevoirite ★★★★Galladite ★★★★Heart Scale ★★
    For my personal opinion, I don’t care that much. There’s going to be what, almost 900 Pokémon by the time the new games comes out?There’s plenty of Pokémon already. Some Pokémon being left out is a relatively small thing in comparison. Plus, the new ones that I’ve seen so far look good.

    As for those screaming #BringBackTheNationalDex, I’ve long lost my patience. I can understand that people are annoyed, but if they’re that mad that their favorite Pokémon isn’t going to be in the game then just don’t buy it. It’s a video game. It’s not the end of the world. Also certain facets of that community have gotten really out of hand. I’ve heard about people sending threats to the game devs over this (just hearsay, but even if that isn’t true I don’t think it’s an exaggeration to say that some people are way to aggressive concerning this issue).
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Sethal and RadEmpoleon like this.
  10. Enbuoh

    SS Egg #1 Delta Plus
    (Deoxys Egg)
    Level 23
    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2019
    Posts:
    114
    PokéPoints:
    ₽27.4
    Oran Berry ★★Poké Ball ★Potion ★
    I honestly don't really care about the debate and discourse -- I understand both sides and arguments, but for me I just want to experience the full game no matter what kind of content is or isn't in it. I'll obviously still be getting my copy of Sword. But it doesn't mean I don't understand the argument for bringing back Natl Dex -- you know, the way I interpret this is that Game Freak is developing a game where the National Dex will be there -- a possible Sinnoh Remake (am I pushing it?) -- and because they're focusing on that now that SwSh is basically in its final stages, that's why they sort of "slacked off" on SwSh.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Sethal likes this.
  11. RadEmpoleon

    RadEmpoleon certified EPIC Gamer™

    Bondo
    (Sobble)
    Level 9
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2018
    Posts:
    3,297
    PokéPoints:
    ₽4,003.8
    Comet Shard ★★★★Poké Doll ★★
    So I posted a lengthy rant about this topic on Wattpad. All right, let me give my summed-up insight:

    I do think it’s unfortunate that not all Pokémon can be included in Sword and Shield. However, that isn’t a reason to not buy the games (or at least in my eyes). The Pokédex is just one aspect of the games. There are several other aspects, such as the plot, new Pokémon, music, region, etc. that you have to take into consideration when determining whether or not the games are good. And since the games aren’t out yet, we don’t know much about the other aspects. So you can’t go around saying “Oh, Sword and Shield are gonna be trash because there’s no National Dex!” You haven’t even seen the rest of the game. We don’t even know how big the Galar Dex will be. (TLDR: My main philosophy on the whole situation is that one flaw does not define the quality of something.)

    I guess I’m more on the “Game Freak apologists” side, but I don’t fully support either side due to how toxic this situation has gotten. I find it better to stay out of it.

    (Oh and if I had a Switch I would 100% buy Shield regardless)
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Sethal likes this.
  12. BZRich64

    BZRich64 The Mustachiod Machamp

    Late For A Date
    (Bunnelby)
    Level 13
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2017
    Posts:
    2,561
    PokéPoints:
    ₽6,644.3
    I'm a bit disappointed about it, but I don't really think that it's that big of a deal. If anything, I'm actually more disappointed in the fanbase's extreme reactions than I am in Gamefreak for making this decision.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Hraesvelgr and Sethal like this.
  13. Chron

    Chron Memegeist Guardian

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2019
    Posts:
    63
    PokéPoints:
    ₽12.8
    Dang, I guess that really puts me in the minority if I'm still protesting the game

    It's not solely because of the national dex, but that was a start. It's not because of the copy/pasted animations and upscaled sprites, but that contributes. It's not because of some mediocre object textures, but that's a thing too. It's not the removal of old, more unique gimmicks in place of "grow really big and use busted moves, resulting in a goshdang dynamax arms race in order to have any sort of defensive or offensive counterplay aaaaand then the gimmick's gone after 3 turns", but geez that didn't help things. Hop sucks though, I'll say that. He looks dumb.

    What really set me over the edge on this game was the Wild Area. I know I'm probably the only person ever to feel this way, but I hate it. I never wanted an open-world Pokémon catching experience. However, I knew that everyone else and their Arcanine wanted it so it was bound to happen, but... Not like this. Not like this.

    Looking at the gameplay of the wild area, it feels so... Empty. This is Game Freak's first attempt at open world, and Britain isn't exactly the most diverse ecosystem, but the colors, terrain, all of it looks kinda dull and unengaging to me. But that's not what bothers me, as much as how the Wild Area compromises so much of the "flavor" of Pokémon; How they live in their ecosystem. Granted, this wasn't really much of a thing in early gens, but it should be now. I think Chargestone Cave from Gen 5 is a near perfect ecosystem, not focused on just one type but on a certain kind of Pokémon; what would naturally want to live in an area with electrical currents and magnetism? The Pokémon that live there make sense. Route 9 in that game is also cool, with rougher, more "urban" Pokémon being found in areas that biker gangs populate.

    Why tf are Galvantula and Machoke popping out of the damn ground

    That just eviscerates the immersion for me. Pokémon are essentially animals, and animals live in certain ecosystems based on their physiological qualities. Electric spiders and bodybuilders don't just pop out of the damn ground in the middle of a generic grassy plains. Also, in Vanillite's Pokédex entries, it says that they freeze the area around their body, and sleep in the snow. Why's it floating in a lake all nonchalant? Come on Game Freak. If I can only catch half the mons in the series, at least make their inclusion make some environmental sense. I might as well just play a randomizer if you aren't even gonna try to worldbuild.

    Idk guys, I'm just frustrated with every side of this argument. Gen 7 was mediocre in so many ways, and Ultra was a waste of 40 bucks. The fact that they're making so many poor decisions still and really don't seem to care much about their longtime audience (this was supposed to be for the hardcore audience, which was their excuse for Let's Go even existing) really just stings me, and my faith in this franchise is nearly gone.

    If this game doesn't sell me on it before release (Gigantamax Hydreigon might do it tbh, or showing a place to catch Pokémon that actually treats them with respect), then I might just have to move on with my life. Sure, the game will probably be fun or whatever, but if I want fun I'll just go play so many other games. Pokémon is special because it represents the culmination of a Trainer's journey through the games and through their own lives. Not just through the collection of Pokémon, but of building on experiences and growing as a battler, catcher, breeder, artist, writer, and person. Traveling from region to region, making memories with new and old Pokémon, and exploring deep and intricate stories that highlight these marvelous creatures in beautiful and unique ways. if they want to reduce their world, our world, to a shallow mobile gamer-grabber, then screw off.

    TL;DR The lack of National Dex is just a symptom of a bigger problem, one that I don't think I can support. Because of the success of mobile games that quite frankly spit on the worldbuilding of the Pokémon universe, Sword and Shield are shaping up to be experiences with a hollow, flashy story and environment that don't do the series justice. And that won't get my money. Also people need to get the hell off of Twitter if they're just gonna be dirtbags, whatever side you're on.
     
    Mango, Sethal and DuoM2 like this.
  14. LeafeonPrincess

    Unusual
    (Odd Egg (S))
    Level 1
    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2019
    Posts:
    62
    PokéPoints:
    ₽28.1
    @Chron yeah, you aren't wrong. From what I've seen through TV mostly of Britain, it's still a lot more interesting than that- the shots of the open area from the initial preview slapped my art senses in the face- there was nothing there, and not even in the 'broad, empty expanse' way.

    I personally loved the overworld Pokémon aspect of lets go- it made the world feel a little brighter and fuller. I've never really cared about how difficult or easy games are, so it was a nice little flavour to the world.
    But this? Doesn't do that. It all sort of fits together like a diorama made when you were seven- bits and pieces stuck together with no concept of space and minimal landscaping. Also theres a dinosaur you found and stuck in there because you like dinosaurs I guess.

    I'll probably still get the game, but unless there's a preorder bonus then I'll just pick up a secondhand copy.

    i will, however, defend magikarp jump until my dying day- its adorable, how dare you
     
    Sethal and Chron like this.
  15. Chron

    Chron Memegeist Guardian

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2019
    Posts:
    63
    PokéPoints:
    ₽12.8
    I'm so glad I'm not alone with that perspective

    I freaking loved Magikarp Jump I did not mean to include that game in my tirade I'm so sorry, I mainly meant Pokémon Go
     
    Sethal likes this.
  16. OzoneFruit

    OzoneFruit Made The Arcadia Virus a Cute Anime Girl

    Minior (Core Indigo)
    (Minior (Core Indigo))
    Level 3
    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2017
    Posts:
    4,776
    PokéPoints:
    ₽788.4
    Lucky Punch ★★★★★Eject Button ★★★★Castelia Cone ★★★Leftovers ★★★★Luxury Ball ★★★
    Tbh I feel like I'm less upset about the National Dex cut and more about the way it was announced. With a franchise this big, you'd think there would've been something more formal/more prepared than just having the news squeezed into a little part of the Nintendo Treehouse. It felt like they were pushing the issue aside and hoping no one would notice/make a big deal out of it, and as a long-time fan, I felt a bit hurt that something so entwined with the spirit of Pokémon would get what is basically swept under the carpet. Compare it to the Metroid Prime 4 delay. They made a whole formal video announcement explaining the delays along with a sincere apology and hopes that the game would live up to expectations in the long run. That's how you handle something like this. Not a quick "Oh hey, by the way, no National Dex, sorry!" I also get the feeling that Masuda's follow-up was trying to be sincere (which I appreciate), but it honestly didn't really offer any new insight into the policy change, and that only angered fans more. Since the announcement, I've learned GF is also ccurrently simultaneously developing the "Town" project, so there's that, but I just really wish their PR was better at this point so future uproars can be avoided... As for getting the game, I'm still on the fence, because as much as I want to like it, I'm still upset about how the situation was handled, and am waiting for more showcasing of stuff to finalize my decision.

    EDIT: Link to the Metroid Prime 4 announcement for how I would have preferred to receive the Nat Dex news.

     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    #16 Jul 10, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2019
    Gwoomy and Sethal like this.
  17. Chicken

    Chicken Cringe Overlord

    Sven
    (Fennekin)
    Level 51
    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2018
    Posts:
    1,927
    PokéPoints:
    ₽3,412.1
    Ice Stone ★★★★Icy Rock ★★★
    I honestly don’t have an opinion on this. I’ve kinda drifted away from Pokémon for the past few months so it’d be quite accurate to say I don’t really care either. I may or may not get the game depending on whether or not I get a device to play it on(I’m not really a gamer, so I don’t have a Switch/DS/Wii/Xbox/PlayStation/Whatever).
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Sethal likes this.
  18. Hraesvelgr

    Hraesvelgr Snek in Your Boot

    Zapdos Egg
    (Zapdos Egg)
    Level 21
    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2014
    Posts:
    8,214
    PokéPoints:
    ₽11,794.7
    Trainer Card - Cave ThemeDragon Fang ★★★★Philosopher's CowlWater Stone ★★★Great Ball ★★
    This, so much this. I'm disappointed with the reactions and that some just refuse to listen no matter what's being said. Yes is a bummer we won't have them all but is not the end of the world. Game Freak have really spoiled us when it comes to having all Pokémon in the games up until now.
     
    RadEmpoleon likes this.
  19. KnightBlader

    Mina Ashido
    (Mudkip)
    Level 13
    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2019
    Posts:
    127
    PokéPoints:
    ₽399.0
    I dunno how much I agree with that.
    Is it really spoiling if that's what you use to sell product like Pokémon Bank? I don't know. I think they could probably have done better in that regard, especially with them just slamming the door on putting them in later. We wouldn't be having this level of outrage, if they just said: "Listen guys, we don't have the means to put the game out with all mons in it right now but guess what? All the Pokémon that we couldn't fit in, are going to be coming in at a later date."
    Nobody would really bat an eye then. It just seems a bit questionable, to strictly say nope we won't have 'em, and we won't bring them in later.

    Couple that with the game's main game getting worse per entry (at least in my opinion), and I don't think we've been "spoiled" by GameFreak. That doesn't mean we are allowed to act entitled either, though.
     
  20. FireSpartan5

    FireSpartan5 Pokémon Professor

    Zane
    (Genesect Egg)
    Level 5
    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2017
    Posts:
    1,269
    PokéPoints:
    ₽866.4
    Cooler Gary Oak ★★★★★Tapunium Z ★★★★★Choice Specs ★★★★★Flame Orb ★★★★★
    It's a bummer, sure, but I agree with most of you guys. It's not the biggest deal in the world, unless you are super into competitive. Frankly, I get why people are upset, but they're taking it too far for the most part.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...

Share This Page