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Cloning

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by BiohazardSr, Feb 18, 2016.

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  1. BiohazardSr

    BiohazardSr My name is Sid. Sid the Bard

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    Do you agree that we should clone, or is it wrong? Why should we clone, or why shouldn't we? Is there a limit to what we should clone, or we do with them?

    I believe that cloning can be a very useful application on multiple levels. It can and had allowed us to bring back species from extinction that we caused. It can allow people in need of a transplant to get a matching organ quickly. Other possible uses could even be helping sterile mother's or fathers conceive a child of their own. And of course there is a limit to it. With organ donating clones, I don't think we should grow a brain with it. That way it never has a conscience that suffers through the process. Obviously you need the person's consent before doing it. And I don't agree with designer babies. There's some other things that I have, but I can't think of them at the moment. What are all y'alls thoughts?
     
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  2. Megarai111

    Megarai111 Elizabeth 3rd

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    I'm 95% in favour of cloning. When I look at it, I can only see the pros: imagine how much cloning can help save people! Using stem cells, doctors from all over the world are trying to recreate entire organs as we speak and I support this decision. I'm also in favour of using cloning and embryo selection to make sure the child has no severe diseases or severe handicaps. In fact, I can only see the many possibilities this offers us, and because of that, I think stem cell research should be made easier for doctors to perform.
    There are a few things that matter too, though.
    First of all, when it comes to cloning: we shouldn't do it too much. It is important for a species to have a big genetic diversity, so that it's easier for a species to survive if a major change in environment happens. Let's just say we have a certain animal species with a population of 10000, all living together on the plains. Because this species is almost extinct, we as humans decide to clone a few more to help the species survive. Because of that, there are now 10000 extra animals of said species. What would happen to those animals if something big like a flood or a long period of drought happened? Because the animals have been cloned, they all have the same DNA. If this DNA does not contain information that can help those 90 extra animals to adapt to a new environment, they won't survive that. What's more: if all those new animals were to reproduce, the gene pool would become a lot less diverse. After all, all children would contain half of the genes of the cloned parent. This situation I've explained also works for animals that have been brought back from extinction: we should try to "resurrect" as many genotypes as possible to create the highest chance of survival possible.
    Second of all, it's the all-too-questionable "An embryo is a living being too". While these kind of embryonic cells are the best to use for cloning (I mean the cells present right after the fertilization of the egg), many people reject the idea of cloning using these kind of cells because this is "new life". I honestly don't really know what to say of this. I think it's heartless to just use them without thinking first, yet I don't think we should not use them because they are still very useful.
    Third, I don't think cloning should be used to create designer babies either. To me, that feels like "building" a child and give it as many useful treats as possible, as well as designing its phenotype at the same time. That kinda feels like trying to create pretty, happy, smart babies that can all fit as role models of this society. I personally dislike the idea of having set rules for a human being (such as "girls play with dolls" "boys should ask girls out" and "adults are not allowed to cry"), and using cloning to help a kid achieve higher social status by giving him the "perfect" personality feels like we're using our skills for useless things. Humanity needs its diversity, whether we like it or not. That diversity also includes people with a lower IQ, who might be alcoholics or simply not very attractive.

    In conclusion: cloning is great, but I think we should think carefully where and when to use it.

    ..I honestly believe this is an opinion many people out there share.
     
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  3. HiddenLore

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    I have no problem with cloning for medical reasons, or in order to produce more food. If we can grow a heart or lung for a person quickly and allow them to get back to life without having to sell their soul to pay for the doctor, then we should be doing it. I don't think that it is right to clone an entire person. Too much sketchy religious ground with no real reason to do it. I mean why would you need a full size adult clone of yourself anyway? Just cuz you want a twin? Anyway I digress. As for desinging babies I don't agree with it. On one hand I think it might be alright if they can avoid major handicaps, or diseases, but... I don't know. I'd have to be faced with the decision I think before I could make that call specifically. However I definitely disagree with trying to tamper with nature too much.
     
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  4. ✯Ho-OhLugia✯

    ✯Ho-OhLugia✯ Pokemon Masters

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    I am in no favour of cloning. I believe it is really wrong to both people and animals. Yes, I know how cloning can save lives, but it's not natural. It's not what is intended. Sure, the clone may be brainless or even consciousless, but if that clone is used, and ultimately hurt, won't that be wrong? If we just create a clone and then disrespect and tamper with it's life? As for designing babies, I believe it is in all instances wrong. It does not matter if a baby is born with an unintended hair colour, or if their skin is a different colour than expected. It's not up to the parents to decide the fate of the child, or raise a false voice for that child. Cloning does have a chance to end unsuccessfully - what if the designer baby was born with an unnatural twist?

    As for cloning animals, I believe it is terrible. I take pity on the sheep Dolly that was cloned. Just as I am against animal cruelty/harm/exploitation as a whole, cloning a sheep eliminates it's natural desires. It is being used for unnecessary and cruel human curiosity. Why would we use animals for such matters? It is terribly wrong, and I cannot further emphasise that. What if you were a sheep who lives in a laboratory for the sake of being a test subject? A sheep is more intelligent than one can ever fathom. They have aspiring personalities and desire freedom of a happy and healthy life.

    In summary, I disagree with cloning as it is both cruel and unnatural to all species.

    I may have a different opinion on bringing back extinct species. It may be unnatural, but bringing back species is different than trying to cause an unnatural change or addition in the 'subject'. Bringing back animals who were extinct by the cause of selfish human activities is great. Australia once had a beautiful parrot called the Paradise Parrot that was extinct due to silly people shooting. If we can bring them back, it would be beautiful to see such colourful joy-bringing birds into the wild again.
     
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  5. Absolute Zero

    Absolute Zero The second seal

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    I want to ask Mewtwo's opinion on this. Really, would he be for it because it helped bring him life, or against it because of the risks and organic corruption?

    My opinion on the ethics of cloning is directly related to a separate but still extremely controversial topic that I won't mention by name. I think it's mostly okay for organ-harvesting purposes if and only if the organ-harvest cloned human never reaches consciousness (watch The Island or read House of the Scorpion for why that gets problematic). As far as I can tell, before the organism becomes conscious, it's essentially a plant with animal cell structure, but with more potential. Do we get riled up over grass being cut? Or rice being harvested? Or trees being cut down? In all of those cases we are mutilating if not outright ending the life of that organism, but since it isn't conscious enough to feel the pain or the sense of loss, then why should we suspect it cares about what's happening to it. Yes, with animals (especially humans) it's a foggier because there's the potential of future awareness and pain and sense of loss, but if we're able to clearly identify and prevent/precede that very first thought of "I", then depending on your thoughts and definitions, there may very well not be a soul/spirit/identity that lost its life or body. Just a possibility that never came to fruition.

    Now if we're able to clone just specific organs for medical purposes, or just clone the muscles of animals for food purposes, I am entirely for those. No brain, no consciousness, no soul, no pain, no sin or crime against nature. If anything, it might even be less of a crime against nature because we're not putting parts of recently-dead humans into other almost-dead humans (which is really kinda effed up when you think of it that way), and manufacturing food meat directly saves so much environmental impact and ethical ambiguity from the livestock industry. Win-win all around if we can do that.
     
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  6. Wizard

    Wizard Do you feel it? The moon's power!

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    (I use Religion a little bit in this, if you get offended, then please move on)

    I'm going to cite a popular story, although many people totally have the story wrong. Have any of you ever read Frankenstein? Exactly. The point of Frankenstein is that a human meddled with life when he shouldn't have been, as he created a terrible monster. I'm not going to go too much into it, because it's not exactly cloning, but I definitely think it applies. I agree with Zero in that if we clone, then it ABSOLUTELY CANNOT BE ALIVE AT ANY TIME. This is so important, I can't begin to stress that. I can't begin to describe how bad that could be, so I'm not going to go into my full beliefs. That being said, if cloning is done right, there could be so many lives saved because of organs and body parts we wouldn't have had otherwise.

    Also, I'd like to touch on designer babies. No, no, and no again. I understand why people want to eliminate genetic diseases and disorders that children may have later in life, but changing your future child and what they could be is just wrong to me. I believe that God made us the way we are for a reason, and messing with what people look like and also how smart they will be could seriously mess up a lot of stuff. Then again, since I believe that everything is God's will, that means that if genetic altering becomes real, then that is God's will, regardless if it is meant as a trial or as a way of "fixing" people, even though I believe that it would be meant as a trial.

    The whole concept of cloning is something that I don't fully understand, so I'm not pretending to be an expert, I hope. I'm just stating my honest opinion and beliefs, so if I said something wrong, then oh well, it doesn't matter, now does it? ;)
     
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  7. Cobalt

    Cobalt I'M A HURRICANE

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    Cloning, to be honest, sounds like there could be many benefits. And I honestly don't have a lot of reason to say no, but for some reason, the idea just puts me off. I wouldn't object to cloning, if we knew ALL of the uses, and nothing went too far (cloning soldiers, Pokémon: The First Movie type shit) and it was government regulated, but I would NEVER subject myself cloning.

    It just seems creepy. People might want to use it to create life for their own purpose, and god knows what that could be. It'd require some type of sanction, and I would certainly say we should make sure things don't go out of hand, especially when you consider how easily this could further human trafficking, but I suppose logically I'd have no problem with it.
     
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