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Dealing with Knock-Off?

Discussion in 'Festival Plaza' started by Reckless, Jan 3, 2015.

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  1. Reckless

    Reckless Won't take the easy road

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    Knock-Off's been a thorn in my side for the last while. Leaping from a former pitiful base power of 20 to 60 in Gen VI combined with its other annoying effects, how do you guys react when you see that your opponent is running a 'mon with that move in its moveset? Is there any viable way to counter it? Maybe pull a Trick-swap and lock in your foe's move (thinking that they might have Knock-Off in their arsenal.

    I know that Sticky Hold can prevent its effects, but won't you still get whacked with that doubled attack power? (120) And, since nearly every 'mon who has Sticky Hold as their ability is next to useless in dealing with the common pseudo 'mons and Megas that haunt the higher competitive tiers, is the only option left to merely grit and bear the loss of your item?
     
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  2. Tsutome

    Tsutome Knight of the Styx

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    I was thinking Red Card, but that still doesn't protect your other Pokémon from losing their items. For Pokémon with Acrobatics, there's no need for items at all (unless you also use Fling). Other than that, I myself can't find a good counter to Knock-Off.
     
  3. Rafael

    Rafael Math Geek

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    Cooler Gary Oak ★★★★★Star Piece ★★★★Dragon Fang ★★★★Deep Sea Scale ★★★Deep Sea Tooth ★★★
    I've never had much of a problem with Knock Off because whenever I predict it, I usually switch in to a bulky Pokémon such as Gliscor. Gliscor doesn't need its Toxic Orb after it gets poisoned and it has really good defense which allows it to take a Knock Off without losing too much. You could also try using Clefable as it resists Knock Off and it usually doesn't matter when Clefable loses its Leftovers.

    I honestly never thought about Knock Off too much but what I'm saying is get a bulky Pokémon that doesn't necessarily need its item to take the Knock Off damage and retaliate.

    Or, you could always let a Megastone holder take the Knock Off damage instead. Remember, the Knock Off damage boost doesn't apply when there is no item being knocked off :)
     
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  4. Weedle Enthusiast

    Weedle Enthusiast Resident Weedle Enthusiast

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    Well, this doesn't exactly counter it, but will make them pay. Rocky Helmet, they'll take damage for knocking it off.
     
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  5. Noctis

    Noctis *this message has been removed*

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    The only way to counter a knock-off is to use a Pokémon that doesn't use items. For example, get a Pokémon that has Thief. Not only do you have an open space for any item, but ultimately if the Knock Off does come to your Pokémon that has Thief, you can still use Thief again to get another item.

    Thief/Acrobatics/Fling
     
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  6. Skullbash

    Skullbash I will become the Pirate King

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    GS Ball ★★★★★Basic Gary Oak ★Cooler Gary Oak ★★★★★Legendary Triforce ★★
    Knock off doesn't work on mega stones. I use my Mega to counter knock off.
     
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  7. Spammernoob

    Spammernoob A Spammer or a Noob?

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    lol You can't counter a move. >.< You can counter common users of the move, but not the move itself.

    ie. Your team uses Clefable to counter Knock Off. What do you do against Bisharp? :[
    That being said, M-Sableye and Mandibuzz are both pretty safe vs. common Knock Off users, such as the aforementioned Bisharp, M-Gallade, and Crawdaunt.

    Also, Knock Off is Base 65 power, *1.5 boost vs. items to 97.5 power.
     
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  8. Reckless

    Reckless Won't take the easy road

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    Whoops, my bad. Seems like I didn't look at Bulbapedia's page on the move correctly. Thanks for clearing things up.
     
  9. Prosecutor

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    I know how to make somebody pay for using Knock Off. Make a Defensive Cobalion with no item or the Rocky Helmet. Watch them suffer as you get attack boosts with Justified.
     
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  10. Ricken

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    Lucario also does that pretty well, except for it lacks the bulk. Knock Off can be dealt with in a lot of different ways. You just have to exploit these Justified Pokémon to get the attack raise and to scare the opponent out of using Knock Off for the rest of the match.
     
  11. MrTimtendo

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    Knock Off (along with Foul Play, Pursuit and Sucker Punch) are the reasons I can't stand having a Dark-type weakness.
    ^Even though I do use Eviolite Misdreavus... lol

    Don't really think you can counter it, tbh. Your Mega is pretty much your best bet (unless they're also weak to it... i.e. Alakazam or Banette >.>). I usually have either Mega Houndoom (who resists it and has decent bulk after Mega Evolving) or Mega Venusaur (has good typing and good bulk overall).

    I just have to bear with the loss of my item. Some of my Pokémon are heavily crippled or just KO'd by it (i.e. Espeon, Misdreavus, Tentacruel), while some aren't too crippled (those being my Vaporeon & Umbreon since I still find them tanking for days xD).

    --

    Now, let's say Gamefreak made that thing 60 Base Power instead. How scary would that be with Technician?!
    ^I look at you, (Mega) Scizor.
    But imagine they actually did that, gave a Dark-type Technician and access to the move with a decent Attack stat. X__X
     
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  12. Rafael

    Rafael Math Geek

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    Cooler Gary Oak ★★★★★Star Piece ★★★★Dragon Fang ★★★★Deep Sea Scale ★★★Deep Sea Tooth ★★★
    I could've sworn Knock Off was 65 base power though, and that's a good thing - because with 60, it would be broken af if Technician Scizor had it. :sweat:
     
  13. Pitmore

    Pitmore Mild Internal Pain

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    Knock off is the most overused move in the meta for a VERY good reason, its very hard to counter it! yes, you could use Pokémon like mega Garchomp who would take rough skin damage whilst in their normal form, but with Garchomp, you don't know what it is, could it be a scarf? could it be a sash? could it be a mega, finding this out is key, so if you find this out to early, it could cost you the game. the best strategy is use something fast like Togekiss as it has the type advantage over stab users, has the type advantage over knock off, is a viable scarf user which lets it outspeed most, if not all knock off users.

    ~ Bionic
     
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  14. Spammernoob

    Spammernoob A Spammer or a Noob?

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    Y'know what I'd like to see? Knock Off w/ 60 Base Power + Technician Weavile. :3
     
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  15. Xarn

    Xarn Sponsor

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    Quotes (I don't like taking other's credit, so I will use their quotes)


    In easy words:

    Justified Pokémon (not too much to say, you get a boost and your opponent gets the boot)

    Rocky Helmet (losing your item with style, dealing some damage is always useful)

    Defensive Pokémon with useless item (Gliscor Example)

    Mega Stone User (You won't be sending a weak one that couldn't take the hit)

    Thief/Acrobatics/Fling (Take advantage after losing the effect or lose the item with Fling receiving lesser damage)

    Pokémon that resist (Clefable and others)


    I just tried to put some order to give you the information in a clean way. But after all, we have really nice players so I think that you received an appropriated support .

    I hope it works!
     
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  16. Nator

    Nator Banned

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    Surprisingly, Sticky Hold Gastrodon works pretty well. Much like a Tentacruel with Liquid Ooze (or some other examples), the other player usually overlooks it and/or doesn't expect it.
     
  17. The Unknown

    The Unknown Collector

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    Like everyone mentioned, Knock Off shouldn't be an overwhelming move. It really affects psychic/ghost types, as well as eviolite users who need their items or are weak to knock off. Mega Pokémon can always come in on knock offs, as can fighting types w/ justified. Bulkier toxic orb users who are already poisoned can also come in, as others mentioned. But you can always come in on a knock off if your Pokémon has leftovers or low-impact item and a recovery move (like softboiled for Clefable, or roost for Talonflame w/ sharp beak). Honestly, knock off users can be at a disadvantage if that's all they do. If you are experienced, you can predict their knock offs and set up on them, or gain the momentum in the match, as knock off isn't a game-determining move.
     
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  18. TheBlazingInfernape

    TheBlazingInfernape Gone, probably forgotten

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    My favorite thing to do against Knock Off Pokémon is send a Pokémon with Trick like a Hypno and Trick them so they Knock Off their own item and Trick them again.
     
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