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OU Sweep/stall/setup team

Discussion in 'Festival Plaza' started by FunkyGrip2000, Apr 15, 2015.

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  1. FunkyGrip2000

    Apr 14, 2015
    Here's my current team:

    Ninjask @ Leftovers
    Ability: Speed Boost
    EVs: 220 HP / 252 Atk / 36 Spe
    Lonely Nature
    - Substitute
    - Baton Pass
    - Protect
    - X-Scissor

    Smeargle @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Own Tempo
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    Hasty Nature
    - Spore
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Spikes
    - Leech Seed (Needs a better move.)

    Chansey @ Eviolite
    Ability: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
    - Soft-Boiled
    - Wish
    - Heal Bell
    - Seismic Toss

    Shuckle @ Sitrus Berry (Maybe something else?)
    Ability: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 128 Def / 128 SpD
    Sassy Nature
    - Acupressure
    - Rollout
    - Rest
    -(Not sure what to put.)

    I need to fill in the last two slots but don't know what to put in. I want to avoid OU b/c I like using unpredictable movesets. I also want to avoid using gen 5 and 6 pkmn.

    Also, if someone could tell me some good movesets with Smeargle that don't involve moody, baton pass, and other trap setups I'd like to hear it. :)
    I'm fine with any other suggestions but I want to keep my current Pokémon. Thanks!
  2. DracoFeathers

    DracoFeathers D to the R to the A C O!

    Jan 24, 2014
    I'm no good at team building, so I can't offer two other Pokémon, but I can give a little something for your choice of natures for Ninjask and Smeargle at least. Is there a reason why you picked Lonely and Hasty? Those both lower the defense stat for +attack and +speed respectively. Why not use Adamant or Jolly on Ninjask, and a nature that boosts speed without lowering defenses, like Timid or Jolly for Smeargle?

    Also, just a suggestion on Shuckle, why not try using Sleep Talk as the last move? Or maybe Protect? If you have Rest as one of the moves, maybe have the berry be Chesto to wake it up instantly after using Rest? That way if you have to use it again, you can still attack, if you get lucky, when asleep.
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  3. FunkyGrip2000

    Apr 14, 2015
    I'll change the natures and add Chesto Berry to Shuckle.

    If I use Sleep Talk and Shuckle uses Rollout I'd be locked into using it. I think.
    I don't see much purpose of Protect. I'm not intentionally stalling the battle.
  4. DIO


    Legendary Egg
    (Groudon Egg)
    Level 12
    Sep 14, 2014
    What exactly are you trying to do with Shuckle? Shuckle is usually more of a hazard/status setter. Even though you want to use unpredictable movesets, Shuckle still has an absolutely horrendous Attack stat; it's not likely to get much damage in unless you're running the Contrary + Shell Smash wall set.

    A better move for Smeargle may be Stealth Rock.

    You really need some powerhouse Pokémon to hit really really hard and can carry you through matches. Think about Pokémon like Azumarill and Mamoswine that can hit hard and hit fast and would benefit from boosts in Speed and Attack.
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  5. FunkyGrip2000

    Apr 14, 2015
    My goal with Shuckle is to use Acupressure enough times to make him hard to take down. Just one or two Def, Sp. Def, and Evasion raises will make him near impossible to kill.
    Teams without water-Type moves will find it impossible to beat him. Even if there is a Pokémon with a water move I still got 2-3 moves to set up.
    As long as Shuckle has his attack well raised he can dealt decent damage with Rollout.

    Cheso Berry will help him quickly heal to max health and get an extra Acupressure usage. (If he isn't already hard to hit.)
    I want to limit my powerhouse Pokémon to one.

    I was thinking about Shedinja but he'd only be good for switch-in's and I have no idea about the moveset..
    Maybe Spinda but it would be insidiously difficult to make him good enough for an OU team..

    I'll consider Stealth Rock but Smeargle would probably not have enough time to set up ALL those traps.

    Edit: I was thinking about adding an Umbreon to my set.
    What moves should I give it?
  6. Xarn

    Xarn Sponsor

    Level 56
    Oct 30, 2014
    Hey, I came as I promised!

    Lets see...Honestly, you are having a weird base. I will divide this Mini-Guide to leave some things clear.

    Concept of Surprise and the limits that it has

    There are are different kind of surprises if you ask me. Also the surprises are not something that assure you a victory. Maybe you can build the most surprising team, but the results will leave you (the most of times) unsatisfied since common and non-common sets can be always identified because of the functions that the Pokémon are limited too.

    The stats, types and abilties are what put limits to a Pokémon and make them be something absolutly UNIQUE. (We are avoiding Arceus here, since it is able to get almost any function at the game)

    At Pokémon, the surprises are used with moderation and as a resource to create an advantage or gain some turns (since you are making your opponent doubt and even missplay --- This includes switches, overprediction, etc). But if you spend slots preparing surprises, it can be really bad since you run the risk of losing a lot of viability.

    So, I will agree with Gengar's Grin opinion. Using unpredictable sets is good. but using something that is unpredictable with low viability, avoids the main idea of preparing a competitive team, since it has to be viable to be properly called "competitive" right?

    Then, I will repeat the same but with different words: Shuckle is a good Pokémon that has common and non-common sets like the most of the Pokémon at the competitive game and can contribute to the team on different ways that will be limited to the Pokémon functions.


    Common and Non-Common Sets.

    A common set can predictable but with an effectivity that will be assured. For example, if you have the common Special Wall Shuckle you are sure that it will set Hazzards (Stealth Rocks/Sticky Web or both) and resist a high amount of attacks without caring of the damage even from the Physical Side since it has a decent Physicall Defense even without Ev's. But again, it can be predicted and countered faster than the non-common set, if your opponent has the possibility to do it of course >.<

    A non-common set is lesser predictable since it is lesser used at the current metagame, mostly because it is lesser effective than the common set or maybe because the possibilities that it can give can be obtained by another Pokémon with lesser risks or more viability. Knowing that your opponent is predicting the most common set, you can possibily be creating an advantage but you run the risk of having more disadvantages if it doesn't work. But back to the begining, once the "surprise" is discovered by the opponent, it lose its viability unless you face a particullar situation that is normally influenced by luck or just a lot of control of the battle. Also, non-common sets are called non-common because they have lesser options than the most common ones and are limited to particular strategies, if you combine too much non-common, you will be reducing your possibilities even more than normal, what is not good since viability is important if you want to face the most amount of opponents with the same team.

    My point with this, is that all the Pokémon are limited to something. Shuckle is always a wall, maybe with Stall bases or Defensive bases but it will be always a wall with low attack that won't be allowing you to use moves like Rollout even after set-up and a high quality prediction, since it ask for too much ability (and also has really low possibilities even for a professional player, to make it viable) while you can use that ability to use something more viable and get better results.

    Okay, I hope this helps you to understand the reasons and suggestions that the people already mentioned. I also hope that it helps you to understand mine.


    My Suggestions to the Team and Personal Opinion

    Personally, I think that the "Sweep/Stall/Steup" can be a really confusing subject since the name can be something different for each person.

    People with a competitive base can think that it has a set up sweeper with a Semi Stall Team (with Set up Sweeper like Gyarados that will have Shuckle (or others) to give the Stall part), or an Stall team that can have a Shuckle with Contrary+ Shell Smash, or other stuff that can fulfill the description that you are giving us.

    I know what you are trying to have. It is a Set Up, Staller Shuckle. But commonly, the names of a strategy like "Stall" or Hyper Offensive" are usualy used to name the entire team strategy and not about only one Pokémon (Shuckle), so it is hard to know the main strategy of the team itself.

    Shuckle @ Leftovers
    Ability: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
    Calm Nature
    - Infestation
    - Stealth Rock
    - Rest
    - Toxic

    Shuckle is better than Smeargle at the Tier OU. Because of viability, stats and the possibility to create a really good sinergy with lesser complicated ways than Smeargle. But, since Shuckle is commonly ran as Special Defensive it could be non-needed to have Chansey, so you need to pick between both or tell me if you want them together as an Stall Based team.

    Knowing that I can't continue with my explanation because I lack of knowledge about the required information (that you must provide me), I would like to know the idea of your team. Is it going to be Stall Based, Semi Stall, Defensive, Annoyer...? Because the sets, movepool, etc will be different depending on what you want to play, what/how are you used to play and what are you searching with this team.

    So, If you have doubts about what I explained here or you want to get help in a faster way, you can always contact me or the other competitive mentors with a private message or search us on the competitive room at the Showdown Server.​
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